who's most powerful cartel?

Previous Topic Next Topic
 
classic Classic list List threaded Threaded
35 messages Options
12
TRC
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: who's most powerful cartel?

TRC
I use to say this during the Calderon era but would get yelled at by all those that were under the delusion that Calderon was trying to stop drug trafficking. Pan tried to create one large powerful cartel driven by Federal and Military support. Chapo had all the military backing he needed against the Zetas and Juarez. Pan tried very hard to change the political culture from a state controlled power to a federal control. Their system was set up for state autonomy. The PRI wants to redistribute the wealth to all the local corrupt politicians be it local {municipal} and state. It will re-balance cartel power and it could in the long run slow crime. TJ, CDJ, Z and CDJ had to go outside drug trafficking into kidnapping and extortion to support the war against Sinaloa and PAN/Calderon. Calderon sent 10,000 troupes to Juarez and they failed and were run out of town by CDJ culture of the city just as Calderon was run out of Juarez by the mothers of the children his forces murdered. This was because you cannot change a subculture of criminals that have been opporating a syndicate in their turf of 3 million people because someone from down south wants it. They ran them out.

Hopefully as Sinaloa's expansions reverse, the need to create war money will lesson and redistribution of the drug production and drug trade will be disbursed in a more even way. Hopefully we will see plaza bosses take control and even police their plazas and stop kidnapping and extortion like it was prior to Chapo. And you may disagree but that is the way it was. You knew where to go, what you could and could not do and who to avoid. But you were welcome. It hasn't been that way  since 2007.

And Sinaloa has been out of Juarez for 4 years. The day the military ran from La Linea was the day Sinaloa started losing Chihuahua. Chapo never was capable of winning a war. Zetas crushed them in Nuevo Laredo and CDJ wore them out in Juarez. A lot of the propaganda about the Juarez cartel doing bad things was actually Chapo doing bullshit to heat up the plaza. He was the worst. A very evil man. The people of Juarez have been saying for years that Juarez has been firmly in the hands of CDJ for over 3 years. Don't be disillusioned, this is a fact. Have you ever wondered why you hear the names of all the leaders of all the cartels, their capo, heads of this, heads of that and leader of sicarios but never do you hear this about the CDJ? It is because they are in it for the business not the song. Amado threatened to kill anyone who sang a song about him. And back in the day, you didn't even whisper La Linea. They do not put their business on the street and that tells me they are doing business.

CDJ made 50 to 200 million a week for 15 years back when a million was a million. They got power and are well connected to PRI. They are the PRI. And I didn't hear about Vincente Carrillo Leyva rolling all over is uncle, father, family and people when he got busted. How unusual old school behavior seems in this day and time.

Carrillo, Mayo and Esperagosa have all been around for years and don't have inflated egos like Chapo. They all know there is plenty to go around if they play together in the golden triangle. The name of the game is if you make the state governors happy, everyone is happy. That is how the PRI does business.

This question was asked, which cartel is the most powerful, as if the person asking was wanting to hear how Sinaloa would make a come back. That is not the case and politically not the time. The most powerful people are the ultra rich businessmen and politicians. The cartels are front runners protecting product. You have the Columbians, Mexicans and Americans all being represented in this billion dollar industry and if you think one group is more powerful, you need to rethink who. Where is the money, where is the product?
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: who's most powerful cartel?

Chivis
Administrator
In reply to this post by jlopez
 
The way I see it.... the more people that don't like me, the less people I have to please
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: who's most powerful cartel?

choco
In reply to this post by jlopez
@jlopez  Thanks for your excellent reply. I didn't see it til tonight.

I know you said a while back that before PAN took over, the government RAN the narco-trafficking business, but I kind of forgot about that since I wasn't here during that time.

How did the gov interact with the various cartels (if you know)?  Did the cartels obtain the drugs and then follow the direction of the gov/military?  Did the gov/military actually run the Gulf, Juarez cartels?  What about CAF and Sinaloa?

Just curious how all the pieces fit together back then.

Thx for any more info.  Your post is so good I am going to copy/paste it... and probably do some research into your other great posts on the historicity of the government corruption.  You have a really great perspective. Thanks again.

ps... DD your post was informative too... in a little bit different way than what I asked about, but I'm going to check out the link to get some more info on the historical perspective. thx.

303
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: who's most powerful cartel?

303
In reply to this post by Uday
Honestly, I think everyone knows Mayo is not the most prominent, and probably most powerful in the game right now. Azul is the most interesting to me as he is so low key, but has the respect of everyone. I do not think it is a strech to think Mayo and Azul are laying low while things are a bit heated up right now due to Chapo getting caught, but there are not two more powerful, or prominent figures in the game down there now, and soon, if not already, they will be on top and it will not be close. Only way another cartel comes back is if VCF shows up on the scene again. Even then I do not think Juarez would compete with what Mayo and Azul still have. Best way for any cartel to get to the #1 spot is to try and create conflict between Azul and Mayo. Let them weaken each other and then step in. I do not think that will happen as Azul and Mayo seem to be the two smartest narcos out there.
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: who's most powerful cartel?

deelucky1
El chapo no respeto la tregua all cartels had a truce no attacking each other. chapo got greedy thought he was gonna take over juarez who was backing him up from CDS as far as all top leaders they would just send their people for reinforcements when big casualties where sufferd  he had GN fighting for him and el yiyo from mexicali would tag along GN i dont think mayo or azul are intrested in juarez those hopes are over the people from gente nueva that had the connections with the millitary in juarez are in jail or dead they where only able to get couple of plazas that are bordered to sonora . CDS being in juarez is straight propaganda theyre not in juarez and VCF dosnt have to compete mayo or azul my personal opinion!
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: who's most powerful cartel?

nacho
CONTENTS DELETED
The author has deleted this message.
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: who's most powerful cartel?

deelucky1
nacho wrote
Short answer, the police.  I wanted to share something that may be obvious to people from Mexico, but being from the US, I found it exemplary of the problems existing in our friendly neighbor to the South.  I am vacationing in Mexico where I have a time share and come every year.  I have known a taxi driver here for about 6 years and always use him when on vacation.  The other day he was driving us to dinner and I asked him if the municipal police were corrupt.   He advised that the police here make about 25 pesos ($2) a day but have to pay their police commander 50 pesos a day as rent for their patrol car.  The only was to get the 50 pesos is to shake people down or commit other illegal activity.  It leaves even honest policeman in a horrible position, lose your job or commit crimes.  The best policeman being the ones that commit the crimes which impact innocent people the least.....  Sorry if this is off topic and obvious to all of the regulars but, to me, it is shocking.

Video donde Sicarios dan Ordenes a Policias, por supuesto es en Mexico http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=3Xw88J8aWE4
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: who's most powerful cartel?

Frank White
In reply to this post by Uday
Sinaloa Cartel is clearly the most powerful Cartel but I wouldn't discount the Juarez Cartel!
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: who's most powerful cartel?

pilot
In reply to this post by deelucky1
deelucky1 wrote
El chapo no respeto la tregua all cartels had a truce no attacking each other. chapo got greedy thought he was gonna take over juarez who was backing him up from CDS as far as all top leaders they would just send their people for reinforcements when big casualties where sufferd  he had GN fighting for him and el yiyo from mexicali would tag along GN i dont think mayo or azul are intrested in juarez those hopes are over the people from gente nueva that had the connections with the millitary in juarez are in jail or dead they where only able to get couple of plazas that are bordered to sonora . CDS being in juarez is straight propaganda theyre not in juarez and VCF dosnt have to compete mayo or azul my personal opinion!
what does make you think that CDS are not in juarez and think that all the gn that have connections with military in juarez are in jail or dead? I didn't know you know very well the structure from gn in juarez and the state of chihuahua so you can say theres no cds in juarez and the ones with connection with the army are in jail or dead. Yiyo is not gn he works for el mayo.
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: who's most powerful cartel?

canadiana
Administrator
In reply to this post by nacho
In regards to Nachos comment I lived for 6 months in Mexico City in the 80s with a Mexican family One of the members told me the same thing they have a daily quota to collect which goes on up the chain of command right to the Police Chief Her brother had been robbed by police in that city numerous times for his pesos in his pocket they just took it She told me I should read a book called The Black Durazo which explains it all
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: who's most powerful cartel?

canadiana
Administrator
In reply to this post by deelucky1
I searched the net a bit I never read the book The Black Durazo but his name was Arturo Durazo Moreno and was Chief of Police of Mexico City til 1982 and perfected the police corruption being paid to the higher ups He earned $1000 a month but had mansions everywhere theres even 1 called the corruption museum in DF and properties in Canada and US You reporters out there probably already know who he is
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: who's most powerful cartel?

Tijuano
Negro Durazo was Jose Lopez Portillo´s childhood friend(Lopez Portillo was a Mexican president, if people nowadays believe Salinas screwed Mexico, they don´t know who Lopez Portillo was).

There TONS of stories on Durazo´s corruption, one of the most notable mentions he ordered all the cops to bring their share of the bribes they received in Mexican centenaries(gold coins).

Durazo got rid of a cell of Colombian drug traffickers in Mexico city, that´s one of the reaons why Colombians didn´t trust Mexicans way back then(not like they trust them much nowadays...)

Here´s a pic of Durazos infamous "Parthenon" in beach resort Ixtapa.




Si vis pacem, para bellum
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: who's most powerful cartel?

watcher
In reply to this post by canadiana
The book in Spanish is called "Lo Negro del Negro Durazo" by Jose Gonzalez Gonzalez.  Don't know if it is out in English.  The practice of top cops getting paid in Centenarios continued well into this decade (harder to trace than cash). Sources in the Merida program say they have had to polygraph the polygraphers and still replace them every 90 days or so.  Money talks, especially when most cops live at a subsistence level people in the States can really not appreciate.
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: who's most powerful cartel?

deelucky1
In reply to this post by pilot
I said el yiyo the mexicali never refered him as gente nueva by me  saying there is no cds in juarez like everybody reports and says i clearly said they where only able to get a couple of plazas that are in the border separating two states having a couple of plazas dosnt mean they took juarez if you just concentrate on my post your clearly gonna get lost of what im am commenting of so whats your thought on CDS taking juarez you point out i said this and that put wheres your input

what does make you think that CDS are not in juarez and think that all the gn that have connections with military in juarez are in jail or dead? I didn't know you know very well the structure from gn in juarez and the state of chihuahua so you can say theres no cds in juarez and the ones with connection with the army are in jail or dead. Yiyo is not gn he works for el mayo.

Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: who's most powerful cartel?

deelucky1
In reply to this post by pilot
I said el yiyo the mexicali never refered him as gente nueva by me  saying there is no cds in juarez like everybody reports and says i clearly said they where only able to get a couple of plazas that are in the border separating two states having a couple of plazas dosnt mean they took juarez if you just concentrate on my post your clearly gonna get lost of what im am commenting of so whats your thought on CDS taking juarez you point out i said this and that but wheres your input

what does make you think that CDS are not in juarez and think that all the gn that have connections with military in juarez are in jail or dead? I didn't know you know very well the structure from gn in juarez and the state of chihuahua so you can say theres no cds in juarez and the ones with connection with the army are in jail or dead. Yiyo is not gn he works for el mayo.

12