What happens when a load gets lost?

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What happens when a load gets lost?

el Jesse James
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Re: What happens when a load gets lost?

Mosco
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el Jesse James wrote
https://youtu.be/mXhmqEF3qfc

Seems like a nice fella.
El Jesse:  You have to be kidding.  I have known many killers in my line of work.  Almost all I met looked like ordinary guys and gals.  In interacting with people, you must not go by looks.  That  nice guy in the video would rape and flay his mom alive , then dismemer her to make pozole "if" he was  ordered to.  It is part of being a sicarios for Mexican Narco Cartels.  I am NOT exagerating.  

One of the most heinous killer I ever met was a good looking 35 yo woman who arranged to have her 6 yo son shot behind his head as he looked for birdies in trees.  She was convicted, found guilty, got the death sentence... spent time on death row... then got released on a technical detective legal mistake.  She was a real snake who actually believed she was innocent and felt sorry for her.  Yeah, she was a bona fide monster who could easily pass for that nice checker at Walmart.  

Again, do not trust people by their looks.  Apart from violent crook, politicians, actors, certain kinds ofsales persons,  all understand this truism going back to the BRonde Age or before.
Mosco.  
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Re: What happens when a load gets lost?

el Jesse James
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J
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Re: What happens when a load gets lost?

J
In reply to this post by el Jesse James
Depends on the circumstances, there are at least half a dozen variables

But, what I can say 100% never happens, is the "shrugging it off" like you hear people say, and comments on the MB, "well, those are only 3500 in Guatemala, so I'm not really losing much", it's a tense and hard moment for anyone who takes a loss.  
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Re: What happens when a load gets lost?

Mosco
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I retired from corrections  mental health services.  I loved every day I worked because people are facinating creatures.

 People who do criminal things ranging from the most disgustingly  heinous to the most grandest you can imagine often look rather common.   Also, some kinds of criminals will make studied efforts to look harmless or trustful.  Other kinds might want to look mean and menacing.   For example, I could show you a mix of pictures of such persons and you would have a hard time guessing what they did in life.  

Here is something for  you to think about: What kinds of reasons would young men in prison have for decorating their bodies with repulsive tattoos?  
Thanks for your interest, mi,amigo
Mosco

Have you studied videos of sicarios doing their murderous acts?  Have you noticed how, despite their masks, they could be your cousins or coworkers?  And how about that priest you knew as a kid...what was he like when he took vacation in Acapulco?  
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Re: What happens when a load gets lost?

Siderno
Saddly most efficient killers look totally normal people. Like accountant, taxi driver, etc. this even more in organizations that belong to thriving and criminal economies (ndrangheta, mafia, etc.) in social contexts that give him the appearance of being decent against for example a gang member or one from favelas who is already destined to behave in a certain way and therefore easy to identify with tattoos, way of speaking etc.
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Re: What happens when a load gets lost?

el Jesse James
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Re: What happens when a load gets lost?

Mosco
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el Jesse James wrote
Idk man I get what you're saying but I really do believe illnesses and imperfections manifest themselves physically a lot of times through face expressions. I'm sure you'd agree and know what Im talking about if you've had a few trips on LSD before. I know it sounds funny LOL but I swear on a lot, if not most people, you can see any illness or whatever through the micro expressions they unknowingly make. Obviously it aint something that could be consistently and precisely used, but Ive correctly guessed before on a ex g/f she had heart arrhythmia before she told me. Just from looking at the weird little intricacies of her facial expressions. You can really pick up a lot from some people by paying attention.

Of course some folks have a deadly poker face, so I suppose I agree with your point overall. If you worked in mental health I'd have to concede you know more on the topic than me, but seriously you'd be amazed at what you can pick up and see through acid tinted lenses, and even after the trip is long over due to the realizations made. I walk a wide path around anyone who has some bad vibes going on upstairs, by a quick rundown of their body language and micro expressions.. It aint too difficult to fairly quickly see depression, anxiety, introvert/extrovert, bad/good, all sorts of mental and even some physical problems, etc in most people's face. People who are good at swaying crowds are scary too, theres nothing dumber and more dangerous than a sketchy crowd. Some drunk fool yells out something retarded, and for some reason the crowd group-think agrees with it and does it, every time, LOL its really pitiful and sad how dumb people can get in a crowd. Some of the sketchiest situations Ive been in.. eg: girl thats been drinking at a party has her b/f break up with her and finds out he smashed her friend, so she goes up on the roof crying threatening to jump and kill herself, and some fool yells out "JUMP!!", and some other fool "Yeah! Jump!!" And thats a fairly easy going example, but I feel like ya get the point.. LOL its fckn pathetic. Always wondered why the hell it seems like everyone's IQ gets cut in half once the group psychology takes over..?? In unorganized crowd situations that is, I suppose I should specify that. Not necessarily organized situations.
Jesse:  Excellent response you are a very keen observer and have very good skills that could be used in some professions.  Your post, is equal or better than from some professionals I have worked with. Congratulations!  


In what I first wrote, I was referring to first impressions and about not trusting these first impressions of people by looks, I was going by what many lay people often do and make mistakes.  
I apologize t you and everyone.

  Crooks, movie actors, sales persons,  scienist , doctors an many other make their living by "reading" people in HOLISTISTIC ways not just by single pictures.  Let me explain myself a bit more.

 First,  Yes, indeed, lots of what you say is absolutely true and useful in mental health and forensics work.    About fleeting or very subtle  Mico facial and body signs? YES!  Some people are real good at this and apply this skill in their work.  You sure seem to have his special ability pretty well honed.  Again, good readers of people take in many kinds of observations ( samples ) and let their brains process these many bis and pieces of information. These data may include the social context, climate, temperature, time of day, etc, etc.   Just for starters, you see someone on a cold day sweating.  Or you see two people at a wedding blinking or finger wiggling oddly now and then, stuff like that.  Trivial looking data to others may be like waving flags to a person who knows how to "read" people.  Yeah, think of people as books in different moving libraries, through all kinds of settings, time of day, situations, etc.   People stuck in slow moving traffic can be facinating intertainment for making hypothesis. ...watching people shop, party, dance, work, drive, also.  I tend to never be bored because I just naturally fall into "reading"  people:wherever I am...church, traffic, work, restaurant, etc.
Let me go on more with example of what I am trying to convey.

  I will give you 3 examples:
1. Gypsy fortune tellers , palm readers, unscrupulous sales people look and or feel for micro clues people give off.  There is the thing called the "tell"...this is a fleeting moment when the victim  of a scam is literally hooked like a fish to be reeled in.

A jewelry store sales person I know t, says that he can tell with pretty well, about potential customers such things as:
 What kind of work, earnings, social class, fears, joys, needs, etc, etc?, ?, just by the way he walks, looks at things, and tries to be slick.  This saleman told me that people give all kinds of clues about themselves constantly, how they walk, talk, suck  or bite their lips, scratch,, stroke their hair, balls, twist and turn, vary their speech patterns.... and who is actually the one who will decide to buy or not.  A car salesman once told me that the  guy acting like the tire kicking buyer is not always the actual decision maker. It could be the wife or the pimple faced tenager.  So he looks for signs and changes his sale approaches accordingly.  If it is the teen, he might point out things teen like. Get it?

  Posture is very telling as is a person's eyes  and mouth movements .... these are  almost the golden pathway to the mind.   Also clamy hands, sweat, twitches, etc. Are good signs to look for.  The "absence" of behavioal signs is also important!  YUP, it is useful to know if people "do not react" in certain way when they should is  very revealing.   Not laughing or smiling, sobbing, grimacing, blinking, etc. can also be useful clues.

Combine all the above type of things I things I am saying trying to say and put the all into a toolbox .... think of this way and we will understand that peoples bodies constantly talk. .. The can even talk about themseves when dead in a forensics sciences medical examiner's lab (age, sex,  blood type, tattoes, occupational scars and scabs, diseases and ailments, drug, tobacco, and alcohol abuse, even hair, and, of course DNA data.)

2. Detectives ( the good one) apply the above observational toolbox to catch or identify crooks.  They even have the "Mutt and Jeff " routine or the "good guy- bad guy" routine ( and other routines).  In questioning suspects or kin, friends, partners of criminals, detectives can instill bits of fear, relief, relaxation, and even make the suspect feel that he/she is fooling the cops and winning.  Cops love it when crooks think they are dumb.  When a crooks thinks this way they relax their guard or give of body and face "tells".  Many ordinary people also have these skills.... Jurors, for example often study very acutely "how" People behave and the ways they twist, turn, hesitate, or answer questions.  Good jurors also  use the above observational toolbox.

3.  Scientific observational  tools  have been around for many years they can now video, capture speech patterns, respiration rates, eye movements, subtle eye, hand, mouth, feet, etc..kinds of data. These kinds of data can be viewed in slow motion or used to test hypotheses.  Here is just on little test in dealing with crooks. Ask a person to tell you the name of their mom or dad.  Ordinary people spontaneously answer without delay.  Criminal and antisocial delay just a little bit ...Why? Because they are on "guard" as a matter of not being caught. The crook,is delayed in responding because he is taking time to process what good or bad might come of  his answer.

If you have not read  Sherlock Holmes' stories ... check them out, he is famous for all the kinds of things I am trying to convey.  In fact, by what you wrote about yoursef,  you seem to have a bit of Sherlock Holmes in you.

Modern Times:

Yup, now we have computers, video, sound, etc to make body and face reactions into useful data that reven thinges abut people.  Whole other very interesting topic I can't get it here for lack ofvtime.
 

A Big Warning: much of the above may NOT"  be useful in formal court proceedings...Mostly because there can be much room for error.  For example, one can't say in court, " I know he is guilty ( or innocent) by the way he licked his lips and looked down, while rubbing his sweaty hands on his knees."   But, jurers, lawyers, spectators, often silentlly take these behavioral tid bits into consideration in formulating the impressions.

Here is a classic Biblical case: Two mothers are in front of King Solomon about being the true mother a baby in arms.  After haggling over the child a good time, King Solomon, stopped them and ordered the bailiff to draw his sword to cut the child in half.   One of the mothers burts out in panic pointing at the other woman,  "She can have the child!"  King Solomon, right there instantly knew who the true mother was.  No mother would ever let her child be cut in half.  
 Let me say a little about professional seduction practices in drug dealing, prostitution. Potential customers are often lured, seductively stimulated into generating behavioral clues that indicate whether the fish is being hooked or getting away.  This is applied behavioral observation principles that goes back to Adam and Eve.  (the apple a drug, Eve's seduction prostitution?).

Crowd Behavior.
About, your mention of crowd behavior.  You are spot on.  There are books on the madness of crowds that deal with the things you wrote.   Crowds can become like bees or wild animal herds that have been spooked.  People in crowds loose their individuality and tend to glue themselves to the preachings or rantings of certain people.  Hitler actually applied and practiced crowd behavioral manipulation to a very high degree.  Evangelical preachers, politicians, muscians, rabble rousers, military commanders, and mutineers all apply crowd manipulation techniques.  I can't go into detail on why individual join into crowd behavior... big topic.  But you are right fear becoming a member of any crowd.  I myself alway keep my guard up to void this state of mind. I alway have an escape plan and pick spots to stand on the outer fringes. I also keep the emotional quality and fervance of crowds in mind.  When crowds just first start looking like herd animals is when I sense danger and leave.  

There is a saying among crooks that goes like this "Never snitch on yourself."  Guess what? Most street level kinds of crooks constantly do this because they do it nonverbally all the time.  Cops read what you wear, tattoes, hair styles, mannerisms, etc. all the time.  Crooks also say they live by the honor code: "Never be a snitch!".... Not true!  Many , many crimes are solved because crooks commonly snitch on others.  Cops could not do their work without CIS (confidential informants).  The saying should be changed to " Never get 'caught' snitching."

Jesse, there is much more I could have written on facial, body, and related other things about reading people..   I think you are a natural keen observer who make a great professional in ares needing these skills that not everyone has.  Even trained professional with degrees that I have known lack them.  

Are you young and looking for a career?  If so, there might be opportunities here. Just saying.

Thank you for the opportunity to ramblE on on this topic.

P.S. There are a number of psychological tests used to determine many things about people.  These take professional training to administer and interpret.  There are also, personality profile instruments that can be used to catch the crook or help free the innocent.
Mosco
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Re: What happens when a load gets lost?

el Jesse James
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Re: What happens when a load gets lost?

Ciro
off topic but important el jesse james you should work with Chivas on making this site a little more secure if you have some free time.  Chivas you should give him permission to audit your site.