UPDATE: Aussie surfers shot before being set on fire

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UPDATE: Aussie surfers shot before being set on fire

choco
This post was updated on .
UPDATE:  Pls see the article posted in comments for some speculation on local cartel involvement and other information from Mayor.

UPDATE 12-3:  Still horrible, but makes me feel a bit better that they died quickly, if true.
http://www.theguardian.com/world/2015/dec/04/missing-australian-surfers-bodies-in-van-had-gun-wounds-says-mexican-official

A Mexican official says the two bodies found in a burnt-out van belonging to a missing Australian tourist had gunshot wounds, suggesting the victims were killed before being set on fire.

The bodies are yet to be identified as those of the two Australian surfers who went missing two weeks ago in Mexico’s violence-plagued Sinaloa state. DNA tests are being carried out.

The vehicle’s identification numbers match those of a van owned by one of the men.

The Mexican official, who was not authorised to be named, confirmed the gunshot wounds on Thursday and said it was a case of homicide.

Dean Lucas and Adam Coleman had driven to Mexico from Edmonton, Alberta, and went missing on 20 November while travelling to the city of Guadalajara to visit Coleman’s girlfriend, Andrea Gómez.


Mexico tests DNA of burned bodies as fears for Australian surfers grow
 Read more
Gómez said this week that the pair, both 33, left Edmonton with another friend, whom they had dropped off in Las Vegas before continuing south along Mexico’s Pacific coast, picking up odd jobs along the way to fund their trip.

“I had talked to them about the insecurity [in Mexico] but I never told them about the terrible things that could happen. For that I feel a bit responsible,” she said.
__________________________________________

Two Aussie surfers in a Chevy van arrived in Topolabampo, Sinaloa at 10 pm, Nov 20, on the ferry.

They were due to arrive in Guadalajara the next day but never arrived and have not been heard from, altho other people have been using their cell phones.

Their burned out van was found on a rural road near San Blas in Novalato the next day by people walking down the road. There is a photo below.

My question is... are there any forum readers from that area who might have any knowledge of what happened or who can suggest any leads to follow?  

The article says two burned bodies were found in the van, as well as "many cans" that may indicate "commercial trade".... anyone have a clue about that?  I was speculating that perhaps the two guys were kidnapped and the kidnappers might have been involved in meth manufacturing which could have led to the fire.  But i guess it is also possible that somehow something caught on fire in the van while the guys were sleeping.... Or perhaps the more obvious thought, given how completely incinerated the van is, that some cartel members or others torched the van completely with gasoline.

Any other ideas?  



http://www.vivalanoticia.com/Noticia.aspx?ID=19036

DOS HOMBRES SON QUEMADOS DENTRO DE UNA CAMIONETA EN NAVOLATO
Navolato, Sinaloa. | 11/21/2015 3:24 PM | Por: Redacción.

Fue localizada una camioneta a la que prendieron fuego con dos personas dentro. El hallazgo ocurrió en la carretera de terracería "la 25" que va del poblado El Tigre a San Blas, Navolato.

Vecinos del lugar transitaban por una vereda cuando distinguieron una camioneta Chevy- Vans entre unas tierras de cultivo. Al acercarse descubrieron en el interior dos personas calcinadas.

Se presume que estas personas se dedicaban al comercio porque dentro de la unidad se encontró gran cantidad de latas quemadas y una bicicleta donde se ubica la llanta de refacción.

Al lugar acudieron elementos de seguridad de la policía municipal y estatal.
- See more at: http://www.vivalanoticia.com/Noticia.aspx?ID=19036#sthash.DeGz2IMW.dpuf
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Re: Aussie surfers last seen in Topo Sinaloa - burned out van with 2 bodies found in Nayarit

stevectpa
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Re: Aussie surfers last seen in Topo Sinaloa - burned out van with 2 bodies found in Nayarit

stevectpa
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Re: Aussie surfers last seen in Topo Sinaloa - burned out van with 2 bodies found in Nayarit

Siskiyou_Kid
In reply to this post by choco
I remember when the van with the bodies was found. It wasn't in Nayarit, it was in Sinaloa. The burned out van and bodies were found on the road just outside El Tigre, in Navolato.
Those that say, don't know. Those that know, don't say.
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Re: Aussie surfers last seen in Topo Sinaloa - burned out van with 2 bodies found in Nayarit

Siskiyou_Kid
In reply to this post by choco
I think the cans refer to canned food that they may have been carrying for a long trip. The police speculated they were a mobile food truck because of all the cans and a portable stove or grill, but it was most likely for their own use.
Those that say, don't know. Those that know, don't say.
J
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Re: Aussie surfers last seen in Topo Sinaloa - burned out van with 2 bodies found in Nayarit

J
In reply to this post by Siskiyou_Kid
They took the ferry from La Paz probably....I took the same one over the summer, but went to Mazatlan, not Tobo. Sinaloa is safe, but how you carry yourself and chance play a part....Tobo is a very small town, and you stand out even more as an outsider.  I wouldn't say a lot but surfers definitly come to Sinaloa and Baja Sur for the waves, I noticed a few Australians on my trip.  Those ferries is how the shooters came across from Sinaloa to fight in La Paz.
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Re: Aussie surfers last seen in Topo Sinaloa - burned out van with 2 bodies found in Nayarit

dcm90
Banned User
This post was updated on .
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Re: Aussie surfers last seen in Topo Sinaloa - burned out van with 2 bodies found in Nayarit

Siskiyou_Kid
In reply to this post by J
Yeah, I was thinking they probably came from La Paz, not Los Cabos, because it would have made more sense to take the ferry to Mazatlan if they were in Cabo. They were last seen at an Oxxo. I worry they stopped for beer or snacks and got too friendly with the wrong people. They were probably killed for something as stupid as their phones.
Those that say, don't know. Those that know, don't say.
DD
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Re: Aussie surfers last seen in Topo Sinaloa - burned out van with 2 bodies found in Nayarit

DD
In reply to this post by dcm90
@DC90.  If they were killed by the cartels, how do you conclude that the cartels "did the Earth a favor"?  does that mean you think anyone with long hair should be removed from this earth?  The long hair seems to be your big objection to them and your saying killing them was a good thing.

My perception of them from their photos and what has been reported  is they were 2 young men on the trip of a lifetime from their home in Australia.  Being somewhat bald myself I wouldn't hold it against one of them for having a lot of hair.  (the other one is very clean cut looking).  No way would their appearance make me think were evil and deserved to be killed.

I don't ever remember a State Dept. warning or from anyone else that you should not travel in parts of Mexico if you have long hair.  

I think your comments were rude, in poor taste and disrespectful  of the young men and their families and friends.  

I don't think the family and friends had read your message when they issued their last update;

"We thank everyone for their kind messages and efforts to find our boys"

Mr. Coleman and girlfriend Josie Cox
Words are powerful weapons, be careful how you use them.
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Re: Aussie surfers last seen in Topo Sinaloa - burned out van with 2 bodies found in Nayarit

Bjeff
In reply to this post by choco
This story really make me sad. It is basically me 20 years ago. I have done that route many times, taken it all the way down to Puerto Escondido. San Blas is such a great place. Back then I felt totally safe and had such a good impression of Mexico when our van broke down and we got saved by the green angels. I hope the tranquility will return some day.
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Re: Aussie surfers last seen in Topo Sinaloa - burned out van with 2 bodies found in Nayarit

Siskiyou_Kid
Yeah, the green angels are the coolest thing, aren't they?

You must be thinking of San Blas in Nayarit. I spent a lot of time there when I was a kid. This San Blas is a little farm camp in Navolato, Sinaloa. There is also a San Blas in the foothills of El Fuerte, also in Sinaloa.
Those that say, don't know. Those that know, don't say.
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Re: Aussie surfers last seen in Topo Sinaloa - burned out van with 2 bodies found in Nayarit

choco
This post was updated on .
In reply to this post by Siskiyou_Kid
Thanks Stevepcta for the links... and thanks Sisk Kid for correcting the state they were found in.

Here is a link to another article that gives a little more info... last seen late on the night of the 20th at an OXXO (presumably) in Los Mochis asking for a map.  That could have been what got them.

http://www.theguardian.com/australia-news/2015/nov/30/bodies-found-in-van-in-mexico-likely-to-belong-to-missing-wa-surfers-girlfriend-says

The article says the van was found at 10:30 pm... must be on the 21st.

The article also says they were travelling at night because they were trying to get to one of the men's girlfriends in Guadalajara where he was going to stay permanently. Based on comments he made on her facebook profile photo,of the two of them,  he was totally in love with her.  Calling her "my love my life my world."  Andrea Gomez.

I communicated via email today with Josie Cox, Dean's girlfriend... they are waiting on dental and DNA confirmation.

I'm thinking they must have been robbed... but it's really hard to understand how or why their van was so totally incinerated... I mean, that took a lot of gasoline. Truly horrific.

Any other thoughts on why this would happen.... and is anyone in the Navolato Sinaloa area who can get some local info on who/what or why?

Thanks.  It's just so tragic... all for nothing it seems. Reminds me of Harry Devert.
J
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Re: Aussie surfers last seen in Topo Sinaloa - burned out van with 2 bodies found in Nayarit

J
I wouldn't have advised traveling at night from Topo through northern Sinaloa at night.....Thats right in Los Mochis, Guasave territory.....daytime on the main freeway I wouldn't worry, but nighttime is much less secure.
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Re: Aussie surfers last seen in Topo Sinaloa - burned out van with 2 bodies found in Nayarit

choco
I was traveling north on the freeway last summer and got to Los Mochis right at sundown... and with some other info, found a pet friendly hotel just as sun was setting. Felt relieved.  I knew the country I was traveling thru was dangerous, but maybe not this dangerous.
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Re: Aussie surfers last seen in Los Mochis Sinaloa - burned out van with 2 bodies found near Navolato SIN

dcm90
Banned User
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Re: Aussie surfers last seen in Topo Sinaloa - burned out van with 2 bodies found in Nayarit

Siskiyou_Kid
In reply to this post by choco
From their facebook pages these guys spent a bit of time in Mexico, but they didn't have their guard up.

They were in Tulum, Acapulco, and Boca de Pascuales in Colima, and all over the country. Adam Coleman joked about bullets wizzing by in Aca.

It is a sad situation all around.
Those that say, don't know. Those that know, don't say.
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Re: Aussie surfers last seen in Los Mochis Sinaloa - burned out van with 2 bodies found near Navolato SIN

Chivis
Administrator
In reply to this post by choco
This is lucas and his girlfriend who lives in Guadalajara,
I was sent the story from canada asking for help, the family and girlfriend say:

there is no confirmed connection between the Australians and the news story about the burned van


they were going to surf at the coast and then leaving to guadalajara to see the GF.  

I will try and get someone to post the story on MB



 
The way I see it.... the more people that don't like me, the less people I have to please
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Re: Aussie surfers last seen in Los Mochis Sinaloa - burned out van with 2 bodies found near Navolato SIN

Chivis
Administrator
In reply to this post by dcm90
a big assumption on your part.  Pretty shocking IMO.

You remind me of someone....let me think, what was his name...?....?  starts with N I believe
 
The way I see it.... the more people that don't like me, the less people I have to please
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Re: Aussie surfers last seen in Topo Sinaloa - burned out van with 2 bodies found in Nayarit

Chivis
Administrator
In reply to this post by Siskiyou_Kid
they were very familiar with Mexico and speak fluent spanish...I don't know what to think
 
The way I see it.... the more people that don't like me, the less people I have to please
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Re: Aussie surfers last seen in Topo Sinaloa - burned out van with 2 bodies found in Nayarit

choco
The only possible hope for them to be alive is if the van was stolen and somehow the thieves were killed instead of the surfers.  But that seems a pretty remote possibility to me. Even the guardian article I linked to above quotes Andrea, the Guadalajara gf as saying it is not looking good.

But Josie the other gf pm'd me today to say they are awaiting DNA and dental comparisons.

She should be arriving tonight and tomorrow they are going to Culiacan... per the guardian article... to "see" the bodies and do dental comparisons.  

Maybe someone just did this to cover up a robbery?  But incinerating a van this completely looks like cartel involvement to me.  The gas tank cover is open... maybe there was some big explosion, but obviously extremely high temperatures were attained.

I just hope they were dead before everything was set on fire.
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