CJNG took down the Mexican Army helicopter in Jalisco with a Rocket Propelled Grenade [RPG]

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CJNG took down the Mexican Army helicopter in Jalisco with a Rocket Propelled Grenade [RPG]

Siskiyou_Kid


CJNG took down the Mexican Army helicopter in Jalisco with a Rocket Propelled Grenade [RPG]


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JALISCO.- The Cartel Jalisco Nueva Generacion[CJNG], who carried out the attacks last Friday throughout the state, used an RPG rocket launcher against a military helicopter, which was forced to make an emergency landing, a senior federal official said Monday.

The National Commissioner of security, Monte Alejandro Rubido, told Carlos Loret de Mola, of Primero Noticias, that the use of this weaponry shows the "very significant fire capacity' of the organization.

The authorities had already reported that drug trafficking groups had in his possession RPG rocket launchers, but so far it was not known if they had used them.

The Cartel Jalisco Nueva Generacion [CJNG] was accused Friday of launching almost simultaneous attacks in the western state of Jalisco which left at least nine dead and 19 wounded. In addition to firing at the helicopter, alleged members of the group set fire to 36 vehicles, 11 banks and five gas stations.

Authorities originally said that seven people were killed, including three soldiers, and it was reported that three other soldiers were missing; but the national security Commissioner said two were already recorded as deceased, although he provided no details.

http://alinstantenoticias.com/portal/2015/05/con-lanza-cohete-rpg-tumban-helicoptero-en-jalisco/
Those that say, don't know. Those that know, don't say.
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Re: CJNG took down the Mexican Army helicopter in Jalisco with a Rocket Propelled Grenade [RPG]

Rubbertoe
An RPG !!!  The increase of activity in frequency and type is bad in the short run but good in the long run. The loss of lives is a tragedy but there is a sort of silver lining.  The more obvious the escalation the more international coverage, and therefore the more pressure on the Gob. to act, IMHO. I wish they would start to drop shells on each other from airplanes.
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Re: CJNG took down the Mexican Army helicopter in Jalisco with a Rocket Propelled Grenade [RPG]

Siskiyou_Kid
CJNG is always asking for trouble with their high-profile attacks, but I can't understand why they would want the full focus of the government.
Those that say, don't know. Those that know, don't say.
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Re: CJNG took down the Mexican Army helicopter in Jalisco with a Rocket Propelled Grenade [RPG]

tuSancho
In reply to this post by Siskiyou_Kid
I have read several variations on the report buy my belief is they are speculation, not confirmed fact.  Time will tell.  Sort of like the early reports of El Mencho being taken.  I could be wrong.

My hunch is 50cal fired from more than one shooter and they luckily got the tail rotor which will bring it down.  It appears the helicopter was flying relatively low and made themselves an easy target.  They are probably lucky more lives weren't lost.  Again, I could be wrong.

Anybody know if the helicopter was bought with US $ ??  
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Re: CJNG took down the Mexican Army helicopter in Jalisco with a Rocket Propelled Grenade [RPG]

Siskiyou_Kid
I thought a group of guys firing AK's and G3's might have taken it down. That's happened in Afghanistan a few times. Even though it's rare, these birds are definitely vulnerable below 200 meters.

In Afghanistan they aim at the tail rotor during takeoff and landing.

Still, an RPG is much more effective than a little piece of jacketed lead, even if it's a 7.62mm or .50 BMG ball round.
Those that say, don't know. Those that know, don't say.
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Re: CJNG took down the Mexican Army helicopter in Jalisco with a Rocket Propelled Grenade [RPG]

tuSancho
Kid, I really take to heart what you post on the forum.  The thing about this to me is two fold:  first, there has been no forensic physical visual/visible proof of what happened.  And second, there is every motive and past history of the government, and particularly the civilian and military security forces, to lie and tell a story that benefits them.

On one hand, the May 1 attacks put EPN and the world on notice that the Mexican government is weak and unprepared at every level and across the board.  They have no legitimate nor effective control of the country and the people's safety.  This was proved certain by CJGN.

On the other hand, by launching a frontal attack, firing the first shots apparently, they have embarrassed the government leaders and their machisimo.  For this there has to be retaliation, venganza.  I am sure that as well staged and executed as the attacks were - totally isolating the second largest city in Mexico, the alleged new sleeping economic giant... the CJGN took retaliation into account with their planning.  They know well that the government has to react, just to save face.  The Atlacolmulco group was out of the loop on this and that won't set well either, I believe.  The cartel preplanned and is ready.

So what does this have to do with the downing of the helicopter?  I believe, more than anything else the government propaganda machine is working harder than any other element.  Second only to that will be the round up and false arresting of anyone who can be perp walked and looks threatening.  

From this comes bullshi*.  And the first BS I expected to hear was that the cartel used an RPG.  It came true.  It aligns with the public's natural inclination to think the same thing so it is easy to make that the public version and people are unlikely to question it.  Puro mierda.

I believe, and have no proof, that the Army helicopter got lucky and unlucky in the matter of seconds or minutes.  They happened to come across the cartel convoy out of sheer luck.  Then, because they were unprepared for the encounter when the found the convoy, they were flying dangerously close to the convoy and the convoy had already been alerted by halcones that the helicopter was on them.  At that point the convoy was surprised too, but being prepared with large caliber weapons and their maneuverability they fired what they had in hand.  With a mass of bullets, like the pattern of a scatter gun, they got lucky and hit the rotor area downing the aircraft.

Why would CJGN be prepared, armed and at the ready with RPGs?  What were they headed to do at the time they were discovered?  There is every reason to believe this zero sum game, in the end, was both a stroke of luck for the cartel, and mala suerte for the Army.

Until I see photos that align with statements and forensic proof, it's my story and I'm stickin' to it :-)
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Re: CJNG took down the Mexican Army helicopter in Jalisco with a Rocket Propelled Grenade [RPG]

Siskiyou_Kid
I tend to agree with you about this being possible bullshit, like other stories put out by the government trying to justify their operations or whatever else they happen to be failing at.

Also, I haven't heard any other source for this claim, so for the time being the government isn't even ready to lie face to face, which they do all the time.

Those that say, don't know. Those that know, don't say.
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Re: CJNG took down the Mexican Army helicopter in Jalisco with a Rocket Propelled Grenade [RPG]

tuSancho
So here you go, from the article elsewhere re the arrested suspects, the article when translated in the last paragraph says:

"DPP does not rule out more such attacks with the activation of "Operation Jalisco" are given, it is a modus operandi that the controls of the criminal organization undertake when they feel cornered."

So the spin is... 'since Operation Jalisco is so successful and such a wonderful government plan the criminals felt cornered so they lashed out'

but under the breath saying... 'lashed out with a well timed expertly coordinated and executed attack which caught us with our pants down and impotent'

They're gonna be spreading BS far and wide.
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Re: CJNG took down the Mexican Army helicopter in Jalisco with a Rocket Propelled Grenade [RPG]

tuSancho
In reply to this post by Siskiyou_Kid
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Re: CJNG took down the Mexican Army helicopter in Jalisco with a Rocket Propelled Grenade [RPG]

Siskiyou_Kid
I read another story where they seized 4 RPG rocket launchers in the area where the Cougar crashed and burned.
Those that say, don't know. Those that know, don't say.
DRB
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Re: CJNG took down the Mexican Army helicopter in Jalisco with a Rocket Propelled Grenade [RPG]

DRB

BDN put up a video of the supposed aftermath of the attack against the military in Jalisco.


http://elblogdelnarco.com/2015/05/v%C3%ADdeo-de-los-militares-calcinados-tras-la-emboscada-del-cartel-jalisco-nueva-generaci%C3%B3n-.html
DRB
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Re: CJNG took down the Mexican Army helicopter in Jalisco with a Rocket Propelled Grenade [RPG]

DRB
This might be one of the earlier attacks? I'm not entirely sure as BDN tends to mix up a lot of different facts.  The article says this happened yesterday in revenge for the capture of el guero (but that happened a while ago). Regardless there is a lot of carnage.
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Re: CJNG took down the Mexican Army helicopter in Jalisco with a Rocket Propelled Grenade [RPG]

jlopez
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Re: CJNG took down the Mexican Army helicopter in Jalisco with a Rocket Propelled Grenade [RPG]

jlopez
Probably should have included a rough translation for linguistically challenged folks, with some background information that explains why Mexicans will find the cartoon so ironic.

Guadalajara is regarded as the birthplace of the Mexican mariachi. A traditional mariachi piece titled "Guadalajara" sings praises of the state, its beautiful women and its manly men, etc. The best known refrain is:

"Guadalajara, Guadalajara, hueles a pura tierra mojada"

which translates to:

"Guadalajara, Guadalajara, you smell like moist earth..."

The cartoon mariachi is singing instead,

"Guadalajara, Guadalajara, you smell of burnt gunpowder..."

Another musical allusion is in the title of the cartoon, "Los mariachis callaron" ("The mariachis fell silent"), which is a famous line in another mariachi song, "Ella". Of course, this refers to the fact that there's nothing much to sing about these days in Guadalajara.

An explanation like this robs the cartoon of all humor, but BB readers deserve to know factoids like these.  
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Re: CJNG took down the Mexican Army helicopter in Jalisco with a Rocket Propelled Grenade [RPG]

tuSancho
thanks jlopez... I can't get enough of the cultural nuances.  When known more is understood.  
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Re: CJNG took down the Mexican Army helicopter in Jalisco with a Rocket Propelled Grenade [RPG]

Tijuano
In reply to this post by Siskiyou_Kid
Don´t know if this pictures have been posted previously, they are some of the weapons seized after the attack on the helicopter.



Si vis pacem, para bellum
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Re: CJNG took down the Mexican Army helicopter in Jalisco with a Rocket Propelled Grenade [RPG]

Siskiyou_Kid
I wonder if CJNG got these Russian RPG's from contacts in Colombia. I know the FARC have received large shipments of arms directly from Eastern Europe.
Those that say, don't know. Those that know, don't say.
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Re: CJNG took down the Mexican Army helicopter in Jalisco with a Rocket Propelled Grenade [RPG]

Tijuano
Siskiyou_Kid wrote
I wonder if CJNG got these Russian RPG's from contacts in Colombia. I know the FARC have received large shipments of arms directly from Eastern Europe.
It´s possible I guess, didn´t the feds claim CJNG had control over the drug routes in Europe? Maybe they went shopping too.
Si vis pacem, para bellum
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Re: CJNG took down the Mexican Army helicopter in Jalisco with a Rocket Propelled Grenade [RPG]

Siskiyou_Kid
I guess money can buy anything, and you still have to be lucky to take down a helicopter with an RPG, so there is not the effort to track with the effort used to find and destroy handheld surface-to-air missiles, like the Stingers sent to Afghanistan and Pakistan by the CIA.
Those that say, don't know. Those that know, don't say.
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Re: CJNG took down the Mexican Army helicopter in Jalisco with a Rocket Propelled Grenade [RPG]

Tijuano
There are a lot of conflicting versions about what happened(as always) but it appears as those inside the Helicopter were members of the Elite Group in Mexican´s army, according to a military friend and from "El Economista", those killed were members of the Fuerzas Especiales del Alto Mando or High Command Special Forces, as far as I know they are an elite group handpicked from the Special Forces and usually work directly under orders from "Los Pinos".
Si vis pacem, para bellum
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