CDG needs to get its act together

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Re: CDG needs to get its act together

El Regio
DURANGO1 wrote
Ok im going out in a limb here but Legalization would not change anything in Mex i theorize it would make it worse. Why worse? If these structured organizations lose their cash crop MJ, Meth, etc these people still need money. They are not going to say ok drugs are not possible lets do an honest living. They wont if push comes to shove their be more of kidnapping, robbery problem in mex that their is now. Some say its the Zetas that started this whole fad but its not just them. CDG does it CDS doest it they all do, its just the zetas with their foot soldiers who are just mere puppets of Lascano that get caught and do stupid stuff. For those that say Zetas are rag tag they are maybe in the lower levels, but once you reach upper middle you see very good structure, id wana say reminiscent of Guadalajara cartel. I cant say CDS because CDS DOES NOT HAVE A LEADER. If you research them they are a federation, Mayo, Azul, Chapo have a working partenership but not a single leader. Chapo is the face the government wants to plaster on their war. This whole CDG internal battle is very interesting if things like this continue theyll go the way of la  familia. I cant hope for a victory by them or the zetas, all that i can hope for is one cartel being powerful. This whole idea of two cartels trying to get a city does nothing by violence. Ive been to Nuevo Laredo, ive had no issues with Zetas or seen anything out of the ordinary. As the saying goes "el que nada debe nada teme" Obviously the bad thing is being in the wrong place at the wrong time.  Just a sidebar does anybody have an actual idea how many really innocent people have died? I know everyone is innocent but a rough number would be informative.
This is exactly how I feel and believe, which is in no way supporting Zetas is it? All the Cartels are equally violent, and they all extort, kidnap, rob, etc. People keep painting El Chapo as some saint when in reality he has been the cause of many conflicts for many years, from T.J., Juarez, Nuevo Laredo, and now Veracruz. All I am saying is people need to see the facts and get over their love for these sorry ass cartels.

"The Tea Bag Party has a 10-15% approval rating. Depending on who you ask. ja ja ja" The wise Ajulio.
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Re: CDG needs to get its act together

DURANGO1
In reply to this post by El Regio
Yeah i saw the previous post, and most people would interpret it as you disliking (fact) the cds and preferring the Z's. Unfortunately in fantasy land if your not for cds your for Z's. Thats why people resort to trolling and insults, i dislike them all Chapo, cdg zetas. The only one i could somewhat respect would be the old cartels since they handle their business wihtout involving half of mexico. Even then a cartel does nothing good so respect is a very fine line. guess most people favor a cartel and havent heard of the honest living get to work cartel lol. I agree with they are all equally bad, i dont have a preference i above all want to go back to mex and be able to enjoy it. people dont see el chapo is about 75% percent of the problem, the zetas being the other part, el chapo just does his work discreetly without the fanfare of Z's. people could wish the Zetas away but its been a year since the split and they are not going anywhere. If anything maybe Lazcano can tighten the reins on the street Zthugs. oh and we all know the biggest supporter is Buela with her hubby.  i have yet to visit the promised land Nuevo leon and my wife is from there so as soon as this calms down i shall go. just hear its bad.
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Re: CDG needs to get its act together

Birria De Chivo
In reply to this post by El Regio
 LOL You almost made me spit my drink up with that comment. Good stuff
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Re: CDG needs to get its act together

El Regio
In reply to this post by DURANGO1
DURANGO1 wrote
Yeah i saw the previous post, and most people would interpret it as you disliking (fact) the cds and preferring the Z's. Unfortunately in fantasy land if your not for cds your for Z's. Thats why people resort to trolling and insults, i dislike them all Chapo, cdg zetas. The only one i could somewhat respect would be the old cartels since they handle their business wihtout involving half of mexico. Even then a cartel does nothing good so respect is a very fine line. guess most people favor a cartel and havent heard of the honest living get to work cartel lol. I agree with they are all equally bad, i dont have a preference i above all want to go back to mex and be able to enjoy it. people dont see el chapo is about 75% percent of the problem, the zetas being the other part, el chapo just does his work discreetly without the fanfare of Z's. people could wish the Zetas away but its been a year since the split and they are not going anywhere. If anything maybe Lazcano can tighten the reins on the street Zthugs. oh and we all know the biggest supporter is Buela with her hubby.  i have yet to visit the promised land Nuevo leon and my wife is from there so as soon as this calms down i shall go. just hear its bad.
Well thanks for understanding and I am with you! I feel the exact same way, I too think those two groups are the biggest part of the problem, with the other cartels inciting less violence. My family is from Monterrey and also some in San Luis, I have had to go to Monterrey due to family emergencies but for nothing else. I can't go vacation there with my family anymore like I used to all because of this war between Golfas and Zetas! Hopefully now that Puerco 3 has been eliminated these assholes can both chill out and we can return to a safer Nuevo Leon.

"The Tea Bag Party has a 10-15% approval rating. Depending on who you ask. ja ja ja" The wise Ajulio.
AJ
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Re: CDG needs to get its act together

AJ
In reply to this post by Chivis
I was talkind to a friend who just got back from Tijuana. He was visiting his wife's family. He knows Tijuana very well and he told me that TJ has gone back to being a much more peaceful city in a country that is still suffering from a major war everywhere else. He says that more Americans are starting to go back to TJ, that the Tijuaneros are MUCH happier. The crime rate, especially the homicide rate has dropped dramatically. Commercialism is on the rise as well. It is not a perfect city but the people have gone back to their daily lives and are not living in daily fear like before. The killings are still happening but they seem to be more controlled. The result of a city controlled by a more professional cartel, not controlled by several reckless cartels. Whoever would be against that, to me, is a person who is blinded by stubborn traditional values.

Buela, you give the impression that you are right in the middle. that your views keep up with the modern times. But I think that sometimes your views are very conservative and very traditional. Your heart is Always in the right place though but to think that one day Mexico will destroy all of the cartels and will probably fix it's military, police system, judicial system and education system is premature. Your ideas are true but overly ambitious, for Mexico at least.

Mexico has to continue what it has been doing and thats to keep putting pressure on all of the cartels except The Sinaloa Cartel and the other cartels who stay under the radar like The Tijuana Cartel and to put more pressure on the more reckless cartels like LOS ZETAS, La Familia, Los Caballeros, Juarez Cartel, CIDA, Beltran Leyva. I know that pisses off a lot of people, especially the victims' families but it's really the only way that this war will end as quickly as possible. That is the key word: QUICKLY. it will save Thousands of more lives. Who would'nt want to save thousands of lives?

How is Mexico to afford these things? I don't know but they sure as hell better find away. The U.S. gives them weapons, information and training on a silver platter so that's up to the responsibility of the president and his staff.

How will the Mexican citizens be able to pay the taxes that you mention? Mexico has too many poor people who can barely afford to pay for their own families. They are underpaid to begin with and now you want them to pay taxes?

We all know why Mexico is in the shitter. Because of Greed and Corruption. Period (.) Mexico is not China. It is not The U.S......It is Mexcio.

So Mexico needs to end this war first and as quickly as possible before it can pursue any other goals. and by accomplishing this, they have to get rid of Los Zetas first. They are a disease. Then establish a ruling cartel. Then focus on cleaning it's streets and bringing back it's Tourism. make the Americans feel safe in going back to Acapulco, Monterrey, etc. Then Mexico can take it's baby steps to fixing it's economy, military, police force, education and judicial system.

Mexico should continue to make money off of the street Drugs for as long as The U.S. continues to make money off of the Pharmaceutical Drugs and for as long as The U.S. wants to stubbornly keep street drugs illegal. Let The U.S. keep fighting it's Stupid Conservative War on Drugs if they want to But Mexico's Drug War needs to come to an end as quickly as possible.

Just my veinte pesos.
CHIVIS FOREVER
AJ
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Re: CDG needs to get its act together

AJ
In reply to this post by DURANGO1
Durango1

Very good comments. I agree with what you said. There should be a one cartel domination. It would make things a lot easier.
CHIVIS FOREVER
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Re: CDG needs to get its act together

Chivis
Administrator
In reply to this post by DURANGO1
Durango...I just saw this...jajaja  yet where the hell is my husband anyway...or his skeletal remains???
In my dreams.
 
I do not understand the Z vs CDG thing here on forum.  99% of folks never have step a foot in places of violence, yet
it is like a sports team alliance...ridiculous and immature.  I only give Zs a respect of fear, fear of how big and widespread
they have become in such a short length of time.  THAT is so scarey to me.  Other than that how anyone can thik i am a supporter of
any cartel really has a scew loose.  or more.  Zs control my state, and my city and everything in it.  They woo us then kill us.  I have
friends whose young sons were taken, because he was behind in quota.  Our chief w3 young babies killed and body thrown 3 blocks from
my office with a "message"pin to his dead body with ice picks.  and so it goes.  and our town is considered "safe".  Zs did this, but before them it was CDG and they did the same.  they all kill, kidnap, extort and are all brutal.  Zs are bigger now and have no soul, yet they offer help to my
blind and deaf kids.  isn't that what CDG does?  They do not fool me, I could take the 12K USD transformer and 20K dollar roof we need from them, but we will never accept "that"sort of help.  I probably will end up paying for it myself, because we have waited now 3 years for the gov.  It was our contract, our deal, but they have offered almost none of what was agreed on.  School has begun and so we wait. 
 
It matters little what anyone thinks about if/if not I support any cartel.  But it is ignorant to think one has to, and that is the point.  One does not.  I support the rule of law and it is doable.  not in my lifetime but I have provided a perspective derived from a astute business sense gained from an extremely successful global business and my years of working in our foundation in Mx.  Take it or leave it, respect it or not, it matters ZERO in the big picture because I have little hope for Mx.  I just dream of what could be.  You may say it takes money they lack, and that simply is not grasping economics.  They already are spending the money required, and we are providing funds that could be allocated as a tactic in this war.  (training municipal police etc)  There is no real tax structure to support social programs; education.  and get rid of the fucking monopolies of people like carlos slim and the Mx gov itself, go to competition and a true free market.  that is where my support is.  Our corp offices are in Taipei (customer support) Dong Guan City, mainland China.  but we have offices in many countries and heave seen the economic structure and successes in places where one scratches its head, and wonder "why not Mx?".  Besides China knowing out the gate how to become capitalists and treat foreigners, perhaps they are successful because they have a strong central gov in place to handle problems.  Yet in my op Mexico should be able to achieve even greater successes than China.  As China will level out and will face great unrest and special issues at some point.  Mx has that behind them in a sense because they are now a "democracy", granted one with severe growing pains, and it all leads back to corruption, weak judicial/prosecutorial  system, absence of rule of law.
 
I am angry, and frustrated because Mexico could be so amazing.
 

From: DURANGO1 [via Borderland Beat] <[hidden email]>
To: Buela Chivis <[hidden email]>
Sent: Wednesday, September 7, 2011 4:52 PM
Subject: Re: CDG needs to get its act together

Yeah i saw the previous post, and most people would interpret it as you disliking (fact) the cds and preferring the Z's. Unfortunately in fantasy land if your not for cds your for Z's. Thats why people resort to trolling and insults, i dislike them all Chapo, cdg zetas. The only one i could somewhat respect would be the old cartels since they handle their business wihtout involving half of mexico. Even then a cartel does nothing good so respect is a very fine line. guess most people favor a cartel and havent heard of the honest living get to work cartel lol. I agree with they are all equally bad, i dont have a preference i above all want to go back to mex and be able to enjoy it. people dont see el chapo is about 75% percent of the problem, the zetas being the other part, el chapo just does his work discreetly without the fanfare of Z's. people could wish the Zetas away but its been a year since the split and they are not going anywhere. If anything maybe Lazcano can tighten the reins on the street Zthugs. oh and we all know the biggest supporter is Buela with her hubby.  i have yet to visit the promised land Nuevo leon and my wife is from there so as soon as this calms down i shall go. just hear its bad.

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The way I see it.... the more people that don't like me, the less people I have to please
AJ
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Re: CDG needs to get its act together

AJ
In reply to this post by AJ
Conservatism is a mental disease!
CHIVIS FOREVER
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Re: CDG needs to get its act together

dario
In reply to this post by El Regio
El Regio wrote
Nope not at all, I have explained multiple times how Los Zetas have affected my family personally. They have lost much of their freedom in Monterrey since this war started between Zetas and CDG, I dislike them both, equally, they are both scum of the earth! What I don't do is live in a fantasy land and believe that one group is better than the other.
However can you point out where I have bashed anyone? If you are referring to the discussion above then you are very wrong in your analysis. I simply pointed out factual incidents, Ajulio is the one that came back with nothing on topic and attacking me personally.
This is very naive. They are not all the same. CDG is a cartel. They are in the business of shipping drugs north. Loz Z is a cartel and a crime syndicate. Much of their revenue comes from other things that hurt the people of Mx not just addicts in the US.

I said it before but look at the difference between Teo and Ingeniero. Normal people did not worry when the drugs flowed north. When Teo went rogue then everybody who was anybody had to worry about being kidnapped and murdered. When Teo was taken out the violence dropped. If Teo would have taken over the plaza the kidnappings and torture would continue until GN came in and wasted him, but that battle would kill a lot of people. Instead CAF and CDS are operating the plaza more peaceful than it has been in a long while because they aren't feuding and aren't extorting the people.

In Cd Juarez LL used to indiscriminately rape and kill many poor women. That has slowed down ever since CDS came in and challenged their reign of terror. LL is still shooting up clinics and parties and schools. That does not happen in Sinaloa like in Juarez.

None of us want the violence for Mx except maybe the Zeta sympathizers. If I had my way then competent and honest police would be in control of the plaza like in Laredo which is one of the safest big cities in the US. That is not an option. Our police are at best incompetent and at worse working for the Z.

Whoever was in Mty: do you honestly believe your city would not be safer if the Zetas disappeared overnight and somebody, anybody else stepped in? Zetas burned up the casino and a polizeta directed the attack.

In CDG plazas they aren't killing kids for buying small amounts of marijuana for personal use from the wrong people. Zetas do shoot kids who buy the wrong bag. They shoot up businesses and take what they want. Zetas shoot taxi drivers who won't look out or sell drugs.

Durango1 is right about CDS. They are not a unified cartel. I worry that one faction might flip if the Zetas begin moving into their plazas.

Priority 1 is no Zetas. If the police can do it and make the plaza safe then that is the best. If another cartel does it then things aren't perfect but in Mx they rarely are. It is an improvement.
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Re: CDG needs to get its act together

dario
In reply to this post by Chivis
If the rule of law is doable but not immediately then what about the time until it is? How many innocent people need to be robbed and killed by Zetas until honest police retake the plaza?

When Osiel was captured the violence started to get bad but it was narco on narco as they fought to send loads north. When Los Z broke away from CDG and started their own thing then the violence against innocents exploded like when Teo started his own thing.

What about all the innocents from the busses who died? Z killed everyone on the bus in case anybody was a Golfo. Nobody else did anything that horrible as a standard tactic.

Z killed hundreds of poor migrants because their guide didn't pay. Their policy was kill any migrant who wasn't being led by them. That was never common either. Before the other cartels were too busy smuggling loads of drugs to shoot poor people traveling for a better life.
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Re: CDG needs to get its act together

dario
I will say one more thing. They say everybody knows where Chapo is except the government. He travels with 300 sicarios and still can eat at restaurants. No other drug lord can do this. He can do it because the people are protecting him. They might not like his business but they know they are better off with him than if Arturo took over then or Zetas took over now.

Would everybody keep quiet if the public knew where Lazca was? Hell no.
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Re: CDG needs to get its act together

El Regio
In reply to this post by AJ
ajulio wrote
I was talkind to a friend who just got back from Tijuana. He was visiting his wife's family. He knows Tijuana very well and he told me that TJ has gone back to being a much more peaceful city in a country that is still suffering from a major war everywhere else. He says that more Americans are starting to go back to TJ, that the Tijuaneros are MUCH happier. The crime rate, especially the homicide rate has dropped dramatically. Commercialism is on the rise as well. It is not a perfect city but the people have gone back to their daily lives and are not living in daily fear like before. The killings are still happening but they seem to be more controlled. The result of a city controlled by a more professional cartel, not controlled by several reckless cartels. Whoever would be against that, to me, is a person who is blinded by stubborn traditional values.
FYI that city was never controlled by "several wreckless cartels", it was controlled by one, until one wreckless cartel came in and began to heat things up. (Does that make me a CAF supporter?)
Simply because the rivals have all been killed off does not make it ok!



"The Tea Bag Party has a 10-15% approval rating. Depending on who you ask. ja ja ja" The wise Ajulio.
DD
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Re: CDG needs to get its act together

DD
In reply to this post by Chivis
Buela, I agree with you 100% that Mx. is f..Ked completely.  Your talking about China's success partly attributable to a strong central govt. makes me think back to something that was said to me by the mayor of a now moderate size city in Texas many years ago.  He was elected quite young in 1951, the next year he was instrumental in bringing a GM assembly plant to the little town of 7 or 8 thou people.  He served as Mayor until 1977 during which time the city grew to over 150,000. He was instrumental in bringing the Texas Rangers, Six Flags Over Texas, and many other industries to the City.  In a conversation with me one day near the end of his reign as Mayor, we were talking about all he had accomplished and he said, "DD. the most effective form of government is a Benevolent Dictatorship".  Maybe he was right.
Words are powerful weapons, be careful how you use them.
AJ
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Re: CDG needs to get its act together

AJ
In reply to this post by dario
Dario, you brought up some interesting points especially about Juarez and La Linea. how ironic that when La Linea had complete control of Juarez, there were hundreds of accounts of young girls who were being raped, tortured and murdered for years. so much that it had become an epidemic. everyone knew that many of these deaths were caused by rich business men from Juarez and Tijuana, Crooked police and La Linea.

Since The Sinaloa Cartel has taken over, the female rape deaths have dropped. you don't really even hear about them anymore. now all you hear is about the viscous attacks and massacres that the La Linea cause on innocents (on their own people) and on the federal police. the last big massacre in Juarez happened in El Cereso prison but it was done by la gente nueva towards los aztecas.

Just another example of The Sinaloa Cartel cleaning the plaza. I fucken hate El Chapo. He is the reason for this drug war but the war is already established and there is no looking back now. El Chapo needed a border city for better distribution and power. he tried for Tamaulipas and failed then went to Juarez and is succeeding. he is a smart business man but he is also the devil in disguise but he runs a tight ship as opposed to El Lazca who is the devil's brother but runs a gang of ruthless thugs who enjoy hurting innocent people including women, senior citizens and children.

If I had a choice Now, I'm going to have to choose EL Chapo.
CHIVIS FOREVER
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Re: CDG needs to get its act together

dario
Chapo is not the reason for the drug war. Chapo is the consequence of peoples addictions. As long as there are addicts there will always be a Chapo there filling that need. The drug war was caused by an arrogant politician who wanted to make a name for himself. The US had one of those too, George Bush.

If drugs had never been illegal in the US I think groups like the Z and LL would have come eventually because the police cannot control things. They would just spend 100% of their time on crimes against citizens instead of spending some time on crimes against another country's border.

I hope they finish cleaning that plaza and LL is no more. Juarez will be better off pacified like Tijuana. The police were useless trying to stop the murders of women and are still useless when LL sets off bombs or shoots up birthday parties of children and sometimes they even participated in it.

If CDS takes control the crime rate will plummet. I don't know how soon that will happen because LL is dug in and has plenty of recruits.

Los Aztecas work for LL, right?
AJ
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Re: CDG needs to get its act together

AJ
In reply to this post by El Regio
That one cartel had different clicks or cliques of street gangs and The AFO was also in relations with the Logan Heights gang from San Diego, who played an instrumental role in the AFO's dominance. It was David Popeye Barron (Logan) who practically saved the AFO. once he died, the AFO went downhill and El Chapo was laughing the entire time. The AFO was never alone in their actions.

Like I said, every gang that gets out of line, forgets to act somewhat professional, and enforces extreme acts of violence to people, always ends with destruction:

John Gotti and his imprisonment and the destruction of a once untouched and dominating Gambino Family cartel; The Mexican Mafias' decline; MS-13 in El Salvador; The Beltran Leyva Cartel; La Familia Michoacana; The Aztecas etc.etc.etc.

It's the Gangs who handle themselves with a sense of professionalism and keep low-profile, who last in the end and the Sinaloa Cartel seems to be that Gang at the moment.

The gang that both You and Buela Chivis support (Los Zetas) should be destroyed. Of course, that's if the Mexican government can get their head out of their asses first.  
CHIVIS FOREVER
AJ
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Re: CDG needs to get its act together

AJ
In reply to this post by dario
EL Chapo is the reason for this drug war. he has gone to war already with The CDG, The AFO, Los Zetas, Beltran Leyva Cartel, The Juarez Cartel (Did I Forget Anyone?) and he has backstabbed almost every other cartel leader. He is the reason why the CDG created Los Zetas. He is the reason why Mexico has a war. I hate El Chapo. He is a backstabbing lil' bitch. But the guy is smart, shrewd and knows how to clean up a plaza so i'm not on his side but if it brings peace to mexico, I want him to win.

El Chapo is the devil in disguise. But Los Zetas are a bunch of dirty ass indians with no class and no restraint. they need to be stopped.
CHIVIS FOREVER
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Re: CDG needs to get its act together

dario
In reply to this post by AJ
I don't think the worst of the worst are so much declining because they're the most evil than its them getting replaced by somebody even worse. The Mob used to run drugs in the US and sell them but they were replaced by even more ruthless foreign cartels bringing it in and primarily uneducated, discriminated people of color selling it. The Mob could not compete with the Colombians or the street gangs because they weren't as ruthless or willing to die. The stories of shocking horror from years ago are common now.
AJ
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Re: CDG needs to get its act together

AJ
The Mexican Mafia has not been replaced. Neither has the Gambino Family or MS-13 in El Salvador. The Beltran Leyva Cartel has broken into smaller factions but they are not half as powerful as when the brothers ruled with La Barbie. Los Caballeros Templarios are not as powerful as La Familia Michoacana. The AFO is now like a group of Girl Scouts compared to when the brothers ruled. No one has had the power of Pablo Escobar in Colombia after he died. After The Godmother was imprisoned, the Miami Wars came to an end and Miami, till this day, has not experienced the chaotic violence that it did then.

The ones who get out of line always have their day. the ones who act like business men and not like psychotic killers last the longest.
CHIVIS FOREVER
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Re: CDG needs to get its act together

El Regio
In reply to this post by AJ
LOL El Chapo is the biggest, most ruthless, arrogant, tyrant of them all. He has killed more people that all the other cartels combined. He has been doing this for many many years. You seem to really praise him by the way you speak. Although El Chapo could not manage to take Nuevo Laredo, Monterrey, Juarez (still belongs to LL and CDJ), and perhaps will will not gain Veracruz either. So he isn't as powerful as you may think.
I see you are just trying to incite trolling and off topic discussions (by suggesting me and Buela support Los Zetas) but we are going to start this all up again!

Peace out... come at me with a real discussion and no more personal childish attacks.

"The Tea Bag Party has a 10-15% approval rating. Depending on who you ask. ja ja ja" The wise Ajulio.
123456